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  • #440809
    anita
    Participant

    Dear Jana:

    This quote from the Buddha speaks about maintaining compassion and loving-kindness, even in the face of extreme adversity and cruelty. The idea that we should not allow hatred to take root, even when faced with unimaginable suffering, highlights the depth of Buddhist teachings on non-violence and inner peace. The emphasis is on training our minds to remain unaffected and to cultivate compassion, even towards those who harm us. This teaching challenges us to rise above our instinctual reactions and aim for a higher state of consciousness where love and compassion prevail over hatred and harm.

    I want to think about it further Wed morning and get back to you. What are your thoughts on this quote? How do you think we can apply these teachings in our everyday lives?

    anita

    #440814
    Helcat
    Participant

    Hi Jana

    I haven’t come across that quote before, thank you for sharing it! It reminds me of a story about a monk who was imprisoned and tortured. He forgave even the people who committed the vilest torture.

    I do believe that compassion and understanding are key to these things. I’m keen to hear your thoughts too.

    Love, peace and best wishes! ❤️🙏

    #440817
    Peter
    Participant

    Hi Jana

    I haven’t seen that quote before.

    The other day I was watching a old film about war where the soldiers behind enemy lines argued about taking some action that in some of their views would make then little different then the enemy. The danger is war is becoming what your fighting. You can see this in the conflicts today.

    A story comes to mind that Campbell told “of a samurai warrior, a Japanese warrior, who had the duty to avenge the murder of his overlord. And he actually, after some time, found and cornered the man who had murdered his overlord. And he was about to deal with him with his samurai sword, when this man in the corner, in the passion of terror, spat in his face. And the samurai sheathed the sword and walked away”

    Had the samurai killed the murder out of anger instead of his dharma, would the samurai still be a samurai?
    I think there is truth in the saying that the end is in the beginning, the inner place from which we act matters.

    #440824
    Jana 🪷
    Participant

    Hello all! 🙂 I’ve been much busier now than I expected so I don’t have enough time to reply in more details. I will do so later tomorrow or during Friday when I have a free day. The quote is from https:// http://www.dhammatalks .org/suttas /MN/MN21.html I found it when I tried to search “Zen Buddhism what to do when I am attacked”. Thank you for all your replies! I’m inerested in your thoughts and experiences.

    ☀️ 🪷

    #440833
    anita
    Participant

    Hello all:

    Compassion (karuṇā) and loving-kindness (mettā) are central tenets of Buddhism. These virtues are meant to be extended to all beings, even those who cause harm. The teachings encourage practitioners to cultivate these qualities universally, without discrimination. The teachings aim at transforming the practitioner’s inner state, fostering a mindset where compassion becomes a natural response. This process takes time and practice.

    The ideal of extending compassion to torturers is more about guiding one’s intentions and inner state than about expecting literal application in all situations (such as.. feeding/ helping a torturer to torture others out of compassion for the torturer).

    Buddhism also recognizes the importance of boundaries and self-care. It’s essential to protect oneself from harm and not to enable abusive behavior. Tara Anand, a Buddhist and illustrator and visual artist from Bombay, India, currently based in New York City, in her article titled “Is an Aspiring Bodhisattva Allowed to Have Boundaries?” published in Tricycle, wrote: “Without healthy boundaries to enable self-preservation and allow self-care, it may be difficult to cultivate the steady stream of energy that is required to walk the path.”

    Buddhability on Setting Boundaries: “Boundaries are limits and needs you express to yourself and others in order to feel safe, healthy, and comfortable.”, “Setting boundaries is how we share with others what behavior we find acceptable and what behavior we do not.”

    Self-care is crucial for sustaining the energy and compassion needed to walk the Buddhist path. It’s about protecting oneself from harm and not enabling abusive behavior under the guise of compassion.

    In real-life situations, the application of compassion can vary. While the ideal is to maintain an open heart, it’s also important to consider the context and one’s capacity at the moment. It’s crucial to have realistic expectations and understand that extreme compassion is a guiding star, helping practitioners cultivate a compassionate mindset, while also acknowledging the need for self-protection and contextual adaptation.
    anita

    #440836
    Peter
    Participant

    Hi

    It’s crucial to have realistic expectations and understand that extreme compassion is a guiding star, helping practitioners cultivate a compassionate mindset, while also acknowledging the need for self-protection and contextual adaptation.

    I often find myself asking: Is it possible to remain compassionate while holding someone accountable and or protecting oneself?
    I think the Buddha is say yes it is not only possible but something expected from his followers.

    I’ll be honest and say that sometimes to take action I rely on the passion of righteous righteousness. Or using the adrenaline boost from fear, anger and hate, which I then take on as ‘being’ – I am angry, I am hate… and compassion nowhere to be found. When ‘I am anger and or hate’ getting even is the most likely driving force behind my actions..

    There doesn’t seem to be a great deal of energy created from the compassionate state, but maybe that’s the wrong way to look it?

    When I feel anger or fear, and get that boost of energy, the energy remains available without me having to ‘become anger’, I can still act from a place of compassion while holding someone accountable or protecting myself. I can do it not from a place of getting even, being right… but from a place of compassion. I don’t have to become what I’m fighting against to fight it.

    #440855
    Jana 🪷
    Participant

    Hello,

    thank you for your replies and opinions.

    The way I deal with this question – cope with my fear of being possibly attacked – is as following. I believe that partly I am able to protect myself by my way of living – following the Eightfold Noble Path. I can protect myself simply by leading a moral life. Then there is no sound reason (for most people) to attack me.

    I think that in practical life, regardless of whether one is a Buddhist or not, these points are the most important:
    – Right Thinking
    – Right Speech
    – Right Action

    If I refrain from negative thinking about others, from false, divisive or harsh speech and from harmful actions in general (stealing, hurting, sexual misconduct, …), I will minimalize chances to be verbally or even physically attacked. Simply by the fact that there is no reason to do so. Does it make sense? (I am exhausted after a lot of socialization so I am not in my best form explaining my thoughts)

    But some of you might remember what I was dealing with (physical bullying, emotional and social rejection). And although I am save and very happy these days (I am very grateful for that), it still makes me wonder how I can protect myself from evil people. I feel compassion, I wish them good from all my heart and I hope that one day / one lifetime they will be able to reach the Buddha in themselves. I really do. I do not have grudge against society or people in general, let alone someone specific. I never did even when I was bullied. I always wanted to understand them. But I know that my compassion, good heart, goodness won’t protect me against a real attack… I know it all too well. (You too, don’t you?) Some people are so lost, they would not be ashamed to kill a monk. And this is a real life… such people are among us.

    Can we really be pure Buddhists to survive in real, practical life where you must socialize with all kinds of people including very bad ones? Don’t you think that there is a reason why Gautamma ordered monks to stay away from ordinary people (even their own families) in the woods and temples? It is written in the first chapters of dhammapadda.

    I’ll come tomorrow back to your earlier answers. 🙂

    ☀️ 🪷

    #440859
    anita
    Participant

    Dear Jana:

    Your commitment to living a moral life and following the Eightfold Noble Path is truly admirable. It makes perfect sense that leading a life rooted in Right Thinking, Right Speech, and Right Action can help minimize conflicts and attacks. True, in practical life, compassion and goodness do not always protect people from real harm.

    “Can we really be pure Buddhists to survive in real, practical life where you must socialize with all kinds of people including very bad ones?”- one of Buddhism’s core teachings is the impermanence of all things. This includes understanding that situations .and people can change. Adapting to changing circumstances and behaviors (including by protecting oneself) while maintaining core principles is part of being a Buddhist.

    Setting boundaries to protect oneself from harm is consistent with the principle of non-harming (ahimsa), which includes not harming oneself. Buddhism is about acting with compassion, but not enabling harmful behavior. For example, if someone is being unkind, respond with calmness and compassion but also assertively communicate your boundaries.

    Buddhism teaches the concept of “skillful means” (upaya) which involves using wisdom and compassion to handle situations in the most skillful, effective ways: finding ways to avoid conflict, using diplomacy (diplomacy that’s to be adjusted to a culture that frowns on politeness/ aplogizing, as you shared about recently..), and seeking peaceful resolutions while staying true to your principles.

    Practicing mindfulness helps in staying present and responding thoughtfully rather than reacting impulsively. It helps in recognizing harmful behaviors, setting appropriate boundaries, and protecting oneself.

    In essence, being a “pure Buddhist” (I read and learn) in practical life involves striving to embody the principles of Buddhism while recognizing the need for practical wisdom, self-care, and protecting onself- and others- from harm.

    anita

    #440871
    Peter
    Participant

    HI Jana

    Can we really be pure Buddhists to survive in real, practical life where you must socialize with all kinds of people including very bad ones?

    I’m not sure how I feel about the notion of ‘Pure Buddhism’ and worry that it could be mistaking the boat for the destination.
    Essentially your asking if it is reasonable to ask a person to be true to themselves, there belief, their values… when having to deal with Life? I feel that it is, but that that does not mean that when we fail, as we will, we do not hold the values we have.

    It seems I’m hearing the question as permission to fail, which I don’t think is what your suggesting. I do know that if your resound to hate with hate, anger with anger, fear with fear… someone cutting you up in pieces with cutting someone up to pieces … your creating more of the same.

    Its my feeling that the only tools we have to influence life direction is compassion and forgiveness.

    #440877
    Helcat
    Participant

    Hi Jana

    Regarding worrying about feeling attacked. I think that a way to deal with this is to build up your confidence in coping with these situations and acknowledging that the past was difficult, and it is stressful to deal with these things even as an adult. But! You are an adult and you are very capable of handling difficult situations.

    You handled the difficulties with your neighbour well. You deal with criticism from others well. Whilst it does hurt. You are a very capable person. Even as a child, you stood up to bullies and protected others.

    My thoughts are that there are bad people in the world, but there are far more average person in the world and there are also good people in the world. The key is being able to tell the difference. The way that people behave with others is a predictor for how they will treat you. People often have patterns. If you listen and watch, you can learn who you should avoid or if forced to interact with them, be very careful around.

    I think that if we are careful as adults, very few seriously bad things happen and the bad things that do happen if you take care of yourself well are often unpreventable and unpredictable. I like to compare my fears with outcomes because I have a tendency to catastrophise. I find that it helps to reassure myself that my worst fears are unlikely to come true and that a more tolerable outcome is likely because I am capable and skilled enough to handle emergencies.

    Love, peace and best wishes! ❤️🙏

Viewing 10 posts - 76 through 85 (of 85 total)

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