No Limits with Rebecca Jarvis: Angela Ahrendts Full Transcript

Listen to the full episode here: http://abcn.ws/nolimits

On today’s episode she’s one of the highest ranking females inside of Apple so what made Angela Ahrendts, a self-proclaimed ‘non-techie’, leave her dream job as CEO of Burberry to run Apple’s retail strategy? And what exactly does the store of the future look like? You’re about to find out.

Rebecca Jarvis: Angela Ahrendts welcome to No Limits.

Angela Ahrendts: Thank you.

RJ: I'm thrilled to be with you. We're here in Chicago on location at the brand new Apple store. You just took me on a tour of the whole spot. Really, really impressive.You have a really impressive career yourself. The Senior Vice President of retail for Apple. You joined Apple in 2014. Former CEO of Burberry where you lead a major turnaround of the company and really revolutionized their business model and helped them get situated for the current era where so many things are happening online in digital. But you grew up not far from here.

AA: About a three and a half hour drive.

RJ: A three and a half hour drive from here in Chicago, in New Palestine, Indiana. One of six kids. Did you want to go into business as a little girl?

AA: No. No, funny, sports I mean we you know grew up doing every sport imaginable from golf to tennis to swimming to - and, and it's funny growing up you don't really think about it we were all in the band we could have been a band our whole family.

RJ: You were in a band?

AA: Well I was in the school band. You'll never guess what I played.

RJ: What was your instrument?

AA: Well the French horn.

RJ: The French horn?

AA: That's only because my older sister played the flute. Another sister the clarinet, another sister the saxophone, my brother the drums. The only instrument that was left, so yes I can play the French horn.

RJ: Do you still play?

AA: No, no, no. I haven't played in absolutely years. But I think when you're growing up and you know when you have six kids your mother just keeps you incredibly busy and everything and you watch what your brothers and sisters are doing and I'm very close to the sister who's a year and a half older than I am. So there's six of us in seven years so we're like really, really close. And you know, three of us in a bedroom. When my sisters went to college and then I would visit them and I think that's where you and - but it wasn't business as much. I mean I've always had a creative side. So I grew up sewing and drawing and I actually thought I'd be a designer, almost the opposite of business. But I went to university and I had a professor my first year in say that I actually wasn't very talented from a design standpoint but I had a pretty strong opinion so she called me a merchant. So that's how I kind of ended up in merchandising and marketing.

RJ: You think about these experiences or exchanges that you have in the course of your career that can literally change everything. And it sounds like that professor set you on a different path than what you might have envisioned for yourself.

AA: Yeah. And I felt so blessed that she did it in the first year. You know and I try to do that you know now you have so many employees etc. and I think you know if you can just be quick and honest and you know any time you have the ability to help guide and direct somebody because absolutely it was a pivotal, pivotal moment.

RJ: so you have this vision that you want to go into merchandising right what did you ultimately study in school for that?

AA: Merchandising and marketing.

RJ: So when you went out looking for those first jobs those original jobs what were you looking for.

AA: Well they unfortunately weren’t in New Palestine or were not at Ball State where I went to university and there wasn't, a little bit in Indianapolis but I knew I was done at school one day and I went to the airport and jumped a flight to New York the next and had one or two contacts. That was it. But I was looking to get into the apparel industry, get into fashion specifically in merchandising, not in the design but working closely with the design teams. And how do you actually bring, that brings their vision to life for customers.

RJ: That's pretty, pretty gutsy of you to get on an airplane the day after you graduate no job, come to New York City knocking on doors. How did you get in the first door that you ended up working for?

AA: Well you know it's funny. I could have gone home but I was afraid if I went home before I went to New York that I might never go. So I thought I can't, I can't make that pitstop right? Just have to go. And then I had only one or two connections and there was a gentleman in Indianapolis that my parents played golf with and he owned a specialty store, a men’s specialty store and he worked with a buying office in New York and I'll never forget Charlie Cooper. And so I went and met with Charlie Cooper and you know young and green and starry eyed. And you know he made one phone call to a menswear company - wasn't exactly what I wanted to start but it was a foot in the door and that's what you need when you're young. And so I got hired in a sales position which wasn't necessarily what I wanted either but it didn't matter. I was in the fashion industry and the rest is kind of history.

RJ: How did you get from that sales position ultimately to Burberry?

AA: Wow how long do you have?  You know it's a series. I, I only had about three jobs in New York and I was actually at that menswear company able to get into a little bit of merchandising but then went to a women's wear company, Jeffrey Bean sportswear that was owned by a big corporation and really then got into heavy sales, merchandising, marketing, and true well-rounded business if you will and worked for a small company for a number of years. And then actually got a call one day from a gentleman who was running the Donna Karan business and asked if I would come over so I joined her as the vice president at it at a very young age.

RJ: How young?

AA: You know I was like 27.

RJ: You were a vice president at 27 years old.

AA: Yeah.

RJ: Did you know what you were doing?

AA: You know it's funny I tell my kids when you're alone in New York and you're young, I was working 80 hour weeks so maybe I had only worked seven or eight years but that was like 15 years you know. I mean that was that was my life I was living the dream and so I knew I knew everything. You know I just would fill my mind. I mean I had a great relationship with her and with you know the gentleman running the business and just learning and growing and traveling the world. And I would say that she taught me the right brain side of the business about fabrics and colors and you know true fashion but then I, then you learn the left side of the business. I went to the Liz Claiborne Corporation and an amazing mentor Paul Charron and one of the world's greatest leaders. And he was not fashion, he was business. And so after having those incredible years with her and then moving over to a corporation where we would acquire businesses and integrate them you know, California businesses like Juicy Couture, and you know we worked with incredible founders that had an amazing vision. So we would acquire their business let them dream and take over the operational side. And it was incredible. I mean I've been incredibly blessed every step along the way. But it's a lot of work and you got to love what you do.

RJ: When you talk to young people who are getting into the industry, for example you went in worked for a menswear line even though your thing was actually ideally getting into women's wear. Would you recommend that a young person starting out today potentially go to a brand where it might not be their type of brand it's not their style it's not their thing?

AA: Absolutely. Absolutely and I think it's in fashion. I think it's in media right? I'm sure I'm sure so many women would aspire to have your job but to get there they can't just immediately, you know they've got to start out in a different and industry, not even a different industry. But at a different level doing something they might have to start up in sports or start out in - right? But they're in they're learning the medium if you will be at media or fashion. And so absolutely. I mean you have to start somewhere. You know I don't care if you're a great chef or a great musician you don't fill a stadium overnight. You have to work your way up and I believe in the power of intention. I believe in dreaming and putting it out there and then working so hard towards it. And I don't think it's a coincidence when suddenly things start to fall into place.

RJ: So you lead a total transformation at Burberry, you're playing at the top of your game and Apple comes to you and says ‘hey any interest in joining our company?’ What went through your mind in those early conversations?

AA: Well there actually weren't any early conversations for about the first year because I kept saying no.

RJ: They were coming to you and saying please and you were saying no?

AA: Well you know they have a search for an executive search for that. I mean life was incredible and I think as a woman what happens too is not only is your career incredible. If your marriage is going really, really well and you're juggling three kids and you know and I had the same thing I had perfect finally I thought I had, it can't get any better in New York. And then they called for the Burberry thing right. It's like ‘no’ I have it all figured out. Life is really good but then you go through the motions and I we end up in London. And so it was kind of the same thing. Now you're in London. You know you have your home you have three kids in school. You know you just acquired some other Burberry businesses back and told the board you're going to double the business in five years and you're bringing on new talent and there’s a loyalty; a loyalty to your team and to the business plan and to your family, everything. It's complicated and it's you know it's hard it's hard to throw. Change is hard right. And yet I think the thing for me is and it was funny. I mean when I went to the chairman of Burberry because I'm loyal and I believe trust is a really important thing in people's lives. So before I ever met with Tim I had a conversation with the Burberry chairman and I didn't tell him anything important public company but I simply said you need to know I need to think a lot this summer. I'm wondering you know if, I was nearing the nine year mark, and it was so interesting because he just looked at me and he goes ‘Don't tell me it's Apple.’

RJ:  Wow.

AA: And I wouldn't tell him. And I said why do you say that? He said because I don't think you would ever leave here for any other company. But I didn't tell him and again I kind of thought about it over the summer and then you know when I decided that fall and right before a board meeting and he said I knew. He said yes but he knows that I put, it’s business but it's also business for purpose and you know at Burberry we had created a foundation and we put 1 percent of the profits into the foundation you know to help kids to lean into the creative arts. We partnered with educational institutions all over the world and he knew that that that was important and to have a platform like Apple to make an impact to do to make a much greater impact than maybe you could make it a Burberry and it wasn't about fashion or tech right? It was about the company, the values and I didn't want to wake up one day and say wow I wish I would have you know what but could I have done?

RJ: So that's what sealed it in your head? You didn't want to think about what could be you had to know. I read that in that meeting with Tim Cook or one of your early meetings with Tim Cook. You basically said to him I'm not a techie. How did that go over?

 AA: Well you know it's so funny. I'll never forget that meeting because with his job you would expect him to be, I don't want to say frenetic but I mean what a job. And I can be frenetic but you know I try every morning to ground myself and to meditate.

RJ:  You meditate?

AA: And calm myself before - absolutely. And I read every morning and just try and rise above it all right? So I go into the very first cup of coffee with him and he has on blue jeans and tennis shoes and he's kind of leaned back and he's so calm. I mean he has the biggest job in the world and he's just so calm and he would ask a question and you know when I would answer. But when I said the techie, he was kind of talking to me about what the role was and I said ‘I just want to be really honest with you. I'm not a techie. And I'm not even a really great operator.’ And he just very calmly you know leaned back and he said ‘you know we have thousands of techies, engineers you know hardware software etc. here. I think we're covered there’ and he said ‘as far as a great operator, last time I looked we've got the most productive stores in the world so I think we've got a few of those too.’ But of course then I would home and eventually when I told my daughter, you know I had told the two older ones, they were heading to university and they were going to probably stay in London but I had a daughter who was going to be a freshman in high school. And so when I told her she looked at me the first thing she said was ‘oh man mom has he met you?’

Both: (laugh)

AA: And I just looked at her and she goes you know like kind of meaning you're not a techie

RJ: Right, yeah.

AA: And I'm like ‘yes he did and he's not hiring me to do what you think he’s hiring me to do.’

RJ: How would you describe the culture of Apple and in particular how would you describe it as somebody from the outside world that isn't a techie?

AA [00:15:08] So the Apple culture which is great and I think that I think you see and hear and feel that if you were to talk to Tim or any executives, it's based on values and I think that's why the company is so into putting their values out there, and right in the reports that they put out etc. so it is a very, very purposeful values based company. And I know you read it, but when you're in there trust me. Now jump over to retail which is about half of the company's employees and one of my hesitancies is in taking the job originally was because we had built such an incredible culture at Burberry and I didn't dream that a culture like that would exist anywhere. And then you come into retail and, and it's so true. You know when Steve [Jobs] originally was hiring the teams for the very first retail store 16 years ago he told them their job was to enrich lives and that has so stuck in retail all these years. I mean it is such a service, servant driven mentality if you will and such high EQ. Yes high IQ in the stores but high, high EQ. And so it just, for me at this scale to think that that there was another culture, there was another company that that absolutely respected and treated customers the way I always felt that they should be treated I was pleasantly surprised.

RJ: From a career standpoint for you, what's been the toughest lesson you've had to learn along the way?

AA: You know, it’s interesting as you, when you start out your career, you have to do. Right? You have to do, you have to prove -

RJ: You have to be an executer.

AA: Exactly. And when you do that the more you go up. But then all a sudden you reach a point where you have to lead and you have to listen and not always tell and you have to ask questions and not just make assumptions. And the higher up you go in the more people that you have, you'll know less because it's impossible to know everything. But when you're at a different level you can know everything, everything. And so I think that, I think there's a lot of self-reflection that has to take place and you have to you have to feel very comfortable living in ambiguity knowing what you know and knowing what you don't know. And building a brilliant team to do the things that you don't know. And then in each position what is your job. You know, what is my job at Apple? Right? I mean with all the stores with all the operators and so and I think you have to get very comfortable on what that job is and regardless of what anybody else says or what anybody else thinks you have to stay in your lane and you have to stay very focused because you know what you know and have confidence in your instincts and what you know, build a brilliant team around you and then you end up with something like Michigan Avenue here in Chicago.

Apple’s new store in Chicago is Angela’s vision for the future of Apple retail brought to life. The goal was not just to create another store but to build a place that is integrated into the community. Here is some of my tour with Angela and her thoughts on the changing landscape of retail.

 RJ: It’s so cool we’re on the Chicago River front. This is the first major apple store in a decade, how is this the future of retail? How do you think of the future of retail what does it look like?

 Angela: You know I don’t want to over simplify it but I think the future of physical retail is building a lifelong relationship. When Steve [Jobs] opened the first store he told all employees that their job was to enrich lives and so how do we do that today? What’s important today that the next generation needs to learn about? You know in world of automation do we need to teach them to be better photographers and better musicians and how to code so they can create the next generation apps - and maybe that’s stuff that Apple does better than anyone else.

 RJ: How do you feel when you look at this store and all of your work that’s come together after all of this time?

AH: You feel, you know it takes a village to do projects like this. We have amazing, amazing partners and I feel, I feel proud that we had a vision and have been able to unite so many people around that vision and again it’s not just the building it’s everything it does inside.

RJ: How do you see this changing retail?

 AA: I hope that it will have companies be more thoughtful and realize that retail is here to stay. All that retail is, is a place for people to go and it’s to build a relationship and have a connection and honestly whether it’s your hairdresser that’s retail, whether it’s fashion that’s retail and don’t you tend to go back to someone who makes you feel good? Who teaches you how to do things better? There is such a role where people need places to come together and it’s continuous learning forever and things are just going to get faster and not feel like they’re behind. So I hope this will be, I hope this will help lead the way in terms of what role retail for every company can play in every city.

Before Angela started to change the role of retail she had a pivotal moment in her career.

RJ: That original turning point that moment from being the executer and the doer and the hand-up and work around the clock the 80 hours a week, you know, that person who says yes to everything then transitioning into more of a leader role. Where did that happen in your career?

AA: Burberry. You know you're now the CEO. Nobody to blame. You're totally You're 100 percent accountable and all my friends when I took the job, I mean I'm still sitting with a country house in New York upstate New York because I was paranoid to sell it. My husband wanted to sell it and all my friends kept sending articles and telling me the probability of failure within six months, one year.

RJ: Oh by the way the people are cheering in the background.

AA: That’s the new store team coming in. And I'll never forget one of the articles that said that there was a 5 percent probability of and if you made it for three years as a CEO then you would probably make it. But there was only a 5 percent probability, as a new CEO that you would be successful in that 3 year time period. So I told my husband don't sell the house, it’s somewhere to go back.

RJ: I don't like these odds.

AA: No I mean you know. But then you kind of forget about it. And I, you know I'm the kind of person to where I always feel that, I feel that everything has a reason. You know I don't feel I'm totally in control over my life. I've been too blessed in too many incredible things have happened and so I do also, I believe that I believe there's a higher force and I believe that you know, that sometimes you don't always want to do things but you go with it. And then it's incredible when things fall into place. And I think there's just lessons all along the way that you learn and they make you stronger and better. And you had no idea that it was a part of preparing you for what was next.

RJ: What is the worst advice you have received in your career?

AA: What was funny and I don't think I've maybe ever even said this but, the worst advice and I was I happened to be in New York at a big corporation and I'm half right brain. So I'm passionate. I'm half left brain linear analytical but I'm half right brain and that means, that's it's not just empathy that's also creative thinking and vision and again I can't help it I'm wired that way. So I'm at a big job and one day a big person in human resources was in my office and said, and I knew that would probably be a transition that the company and a couple of years. And so for some reason they felt compelled to tell me that that basically I wasn't CEO material and that I would probably have to dress more conservatively and I would have to not talk as emotionally with my hands and I had to be more - and I just listened, I'm young. And so they highly recommended that I go to Minneapolis and meet with this person who's going to help me become more CEO like. And so I did.

RJ: A CEO whisperer. I didn’t even know that this was a job. So there are people out there who help you become more CEO like?

AA: Exactly I guess. I only went, I was supposed to be there for a couple of days and I went for a couple of hours and they film you when they critique you and by lunchtime the first day I just looked at them and I said I got to go. I don't want to be somebody that I'm not. I like me and I've been pretty successful so far being me and I was raised on a really big family. And you know my mom liked me, my friends liked me and I don't want to be in a business - I don't care about a title or a position. You know I have to wake up with me every morning and I want to be the best version of myself. I don't want to be this person you're trying to make me so I'm really sorry but I have to go. So I left and literally a month later got the call to become the CEO Burberry.

RJ: Wow.

AA: So I just think that to myself be true.

RJ: Absolutely. I couldn't agree with you more. So many of the answers on worst advice are along those lines. It's someone telling you to be a little bit different, to do something outside of what is authentically you. And it's always the wrong answer. Thank you so much for coming on No Limits Angela.

AA: No it was fun. Thank you.