To Be Truly Effective In HR Leadership Roles, "You've Got To Love The Business of People"

Donna Morris, chief people officer at Walmart, shared her key leadership lessons with my colleague, David Reimer, CEO of The ExCo Group, and me in our latest Strategic CHRO interview. Subscribe here for future interviews.

Reimer: What big issues are top-of-mind for you these days?

Morris: I do think technology has the potential to create a fork in the road for companies. Some companies, by virtue of their ability to leverage digital technologies—generative AI, in particular—might end up with much smaller workforces. At those companies, there will still be a role for an HR team, but that role would likely be specialized into higher-level work around talent, rewards and organizational strategies.   

There will be another fork for companies like Walmart, where we firmly believe that we're people-led and we're tech-powered. When we look out five or ten years from now, we believe that our workforce will probably still be around 2.1 million and that our revenue will grow a lot. Hopefully we will be able to rework the workforce because of technology, which means we will end up sustaining our organizational size but with different skills and different capabilities.  

When I look at the people function, I firmly believe that there will be some areas where we have to embrace generative AI, and that it will lead to wholesale changes for jobs within the people function, too. But the art and science of our roles has to come down to the fundamentals of helping drive the business, the organizational strategy, and the people strategy.  

Bryant: What were important early influences that helped prepare you for this role?

Morris: I grew up with two wonderful parents, and we were on the lower end of middle-class life. So if I wanted extra things, I had to work for them. I babysat from the time I was 11, and my first part-time job was at a dry cleaners at 13. Then I moved to working at Shoppers Drug Mart when I was 15.

I have always enjoyed learning and growing and having a challenge. I get bored doing the same job, so even early on in my HR career, I was doing a different job about two years. I have always wanted to just make an impact in my life.  

Reimer: Given the size and public profile of Walmart, I imagine there’s a lot of pressure to weigh in on a lot of broader societal issues. How do you think about that?

Morris: A few years ago, during the pandemic and the period of civil unrest, we as an organization and leadership team talked about which guardrails will frame what we talk about. Where do we as an organization feel we need to lean into?  

But we're all humans, so we all do have our own points of view on different issues. Post-pandemic, I decided I was going to pick a word of the year and really embrace it. At the beginning of this year, I picked kindness, and now I've decided I'm not going to change my word again. I don't think we live in a kind environment anymore. The fact that we even have to talk about civility underscores the point that we assume that we're not necessarily going to be civil with each other. 

So my approach is that I want to be an ambassador for everybody. This means that I don't want to pick a lane on anything, and I try to avoid any topic that could end up being really divisive or polarizing unless it's a stand that we've taken as an enterprise that's focused on serving our customers and members and/or our associates.  

Bryant: How do you hire? What questions do you ask in job interviews?

Morris: First and foremost, I always want to be clear on the three things that anyone needs to do in a particular role to be successful. Second, I always ask, “What would people who know you really well tell me about you?“ I'm trying to ascertain whether their personal behaviors and values align with what would be a good fit for our company. 

Reimer: When you coach and mentor senior executives, what themes come up most often?

Morris: One common theme is the need to pay attention to the growth, development and effectiveness of their team. So often executives focus on what is being delivered but they overlook the importance of how it is being delivered. How are people working with others? How are other people leading?  

I think a lot of those discussions are about gently, or sometimes not-so-gently, putting the mirror in front of somebody to help them realize that their behaviors might not be bringing out the best performance in themselves or their team.  

By the time people have reached very senior levels, they may have heard the same feedback before, and it can be harder to change when you’ve been working for decades. But the areas that are often the biggest gaps, in my opinion, are the fundamentals of how to manage and lead people, particularly at a velocity that matches the pace of change in the world.   

Bryant: What is your best advice for somebody stepping into their first CHRO role?

Morris: One, know your business as well as any of your peers, because you’re a business leader who now has to tie business and people and organizational strategy together.  

Two, build confidence and trust with your leader and your peers and the board so that you're able to have a point of view for any discussion you might have with them. And are you able to build trust so that you can eventually consult, counsel, and frankly influence when you need to?  

And three, you've got to love the business of people. I know that might seem obvious, but I’ve met a number of CPOs and CHROs who don't fundamentally seem like they really love dealing with people. It makes me wonder sometimes why they’ve chosen to be in the function. That's what this job is all about, in my humble opinion. I think it can be the best role and executive-level position. 

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